Let’s Talk Love Podcast Season 8 Episode 3 with Sabrina Zohar | Transcript

10.10.24

This transcript is from the Let’s Talk Love Podcast, available in our Podcast Feed.

Robin Ducharme | Hello everyone, and welcome to this episode of Let's Talk Love. I love this. I love, I love my job, and because I get to spend time every day or during the podcast with people like you, Sabrina. Sabrina Zohar, you are here, and we are going to talk about love and relationships and dating. Oh my gosh, this is my favorite, like, one of my favorite topics ever. So thank you for joining us Sabrina.

Sabrina Zohar | Of course, thank you for having me. I'm so excited. We booked this like six months ago, and I was so excited, like counting down the days. And so when it comes you're like, Yes.

Robin Ducharme | I know it's been a very, very long time. And so one of my also favorite things is the fact that I work with one of my best friends, Kirsten, and we prepare for our podcast together. So we took your course, the foundation course. We really enjoyed working with you, but I feel like we know you because we spent the last month taking your course and listening to your podcast because you've got your your podcast, which is fantastic. And well, let's just start with learning more about you. Tell us, tell us about yourself and how you came upon this work. Like,

Sabrina Zohar | Oh, thank you, yes, thank you for having me. I'm stoked. And so my name is Sabrina Zohar, I had a bit of a different path, I guess, to coming to where I am right now. I never actually thought I'd be here. I'll be honest, I moved to New York when I was 19 to be an actor, and realized that's not what I want. Yeah,

Robin Ducharme | You did

Sabrina Zohar | Yeah not my thing. Yeah, I was.

Robin | There's probably a lot of people that do that, but that's, that's awesome.

Sabrina | I did musical theater. Was really into, like, singing and but not dancing. That just was my thing. And I think after a couple years of doing it, I started to realize I like being in front of people, but I don't want to pretend to be somebody else. I kind of just wanted to be myself. So I made a big transition after that, and said, okay, I'm gonna go into fashion. And I worked in fashion for about eight years. I worked in wholesale, I worked at retail, I worked at stores, like you, name it. I worked at stores since I was 14. So I've been very like well versed into the fashion industry in general, and in 2017 my mom went to the doctor with a headache, and they found six brain aneurysms that occur to the top half of her head, and so she was given pretty much like no chance of survival. I hit my first of many rock bottoms, and that was actually the first time being at the hospital with my mom and my sister that my sister lost it on me and said, Sabrina, when will you understand you're the fucking problem, and your anxiety is what's causing issues. And I didn't understand what she was talking about. I felt so alone, and that was the first time I'd even known like, hey, I think I need to talk to somebody like, something's not right. And so I just started to dive into my own personal journey, which wasn't really deep. I started my own clothing company, and after my mom's successful surgery, and I really wanted to do something different, sustainable. It's called software, and was just excited about that. So, yeah, so I did that, and I was running that business, and throughout covid, you know, or even prior to covid, like I had, I married my father, and I'll just say that, like, he was incredibly narcissistic.

Robin | Oh you did so you were married?

Sabrina | It was a, we rushed into it doing a like, oh, let's just do it. We love each other, but it wasn't like, by no means did we have, like, a wedding, you know, we went to the courthouse and just said, let's do it. And I thought, oh, how romantic. It wasn't. And so we were together for about a year, and it just was, it got from bad to worse, and it was every childhood dynamic being played out. Talk about repetition compulsion. Thank you, Freud. And I just, I really hit a rock bottom at that point. And you know, to this day, I think a lot of people will say, you're so strong for leaving. And it's like, I'll be honest, he broke up with me, and but I'm so grateful it was the best decision ever. And I'm after he broke up with me, he lived with me for four months, and I realized how awful of a person he was, and I kicked him out, and we never spoke again, uh, except for filing paperwork. So that was when I really dove into my healing journey. I started doing, you know, software I was growing it, covid, all that fun stuff. Take us to 2022 I'm still struggling with dating, because I had the self awareness and I had all of these different things I was hearing on the internet, but none of them were panning out, like, don't sleep with a guy on the first date. Oh, but wait three days to text him, but don't show too much interest. But then, and so I kept, I didn't really know which way to go, and it felt really inauthentic.

Robin | Yeah

Sabrina | And 2022, I was supposed to do Shark Tank, and I had six months of prep, and it was, are you ready? Sabrina was on set for 10 hours. I was next. It was your up next, Sabrina, you see the sharks prep yourself, hair and makeup, outfit ready. Give us 10 minutes. And then 30 minutes goes by, and I'm like, what's going on? And they come in and say, I'm so sorry we're not going to be able to fit you in today. And this is, like, I thought this was going to make my career. So I'm literally gutted.

Robin | Wow

Sabrina | Oh, and talk about, like, just hitting rock bottom again. I get home, I'm like, talk about dark. It was a very dark time. I

Robin | No doubt

Sabrina | Yeah, and like, they did the same thing two weeks later, and I pretty much told him to get bent and I was done. Then, um, two weeks after that, my dog gets sick, goes to the hosp. I take him to the hospital. He dies 10 days later. I. Ended it with this guy I was dating like everything crashed and burned for me at the same time in 2022 September.

Robin | This was like your dark bottom,

Sabrina | Yet again, like another

Robin | Because that is like a lot.

Sabrina | It was a lot. And losing Clem was the hardest thing I've gone through in my adult life, because he was my object permanence. He was my everything, and he was my best friend of 10 years. I got him when I was 22 so I was a kid when I got him, or 21 even. And so 22 and so at that time, I started my Tiktok, and I said, I have nothing left to lose. Who gives a shit? Let me put myself out there. And I started just talking about dating and my frustrations with dating, and people were resonating with it. And then I started to really look and say, Wait a minute, Something doesn't add up here, because we're getting all this polarizing information, but it's not actually adding up. And then I met my partner. This all happened within like, two months, and my now partner, and when I met him, he challenged every norm of don't text and don't do this and don't do that. We slept together on the first date. He didn't really wasn't a big texter, but he was super intentional, very communicative when need be, and we worked through it. And so that really ultimately brought me to where I was was struggling and feeling like nobody was understanding it, and I'm in therapy, and things that therapists are saying are very contradictory to these dating coaches, and I just finally said it's time for someone to speak up for the people like me that feel lost and confused and just don't know where to start to come home to themselves.

Robin | Oh my gosh. I really, I really love that Sabrina. So I'm just, there's so many things I want to ask, but I'm just so curious around okay, like you met your partner just, I mean, you're thinking, okay, I just want to have a fun night. Okay, you were not looking for a relationship on that night, but you were in yourself ready for like you, you had done a lot of work, a lot of so, you know, on, we just did the IG live, and you were talking about non negotiables that you had in your life, right? I think, I think a lot of people are going to learn because you, you talk about yourself in the in your course, a lot about your story and like, how were you, how were you in your life before? What did you done to get ready for this? You'd already done a lot of, like, introspection and looking at your patterns, right? Because you talk, you talk a lot about this in your course, around like, okay, we have to look at our patterns and how we're our childhood and all this stuff that's obviously very important. But I'm like, where were what I'm what I'm asking is, where were you at that point around like, for instance, okay, this is what I need in a partner. Even though your partner that night, you met him, it was just for a fun night, and it turns out to be your boyfriend, okay, your partner, but you were already there. You already like, this is what I need in the partner. Okay.

Sabrina | Okay point, I had changed the way I dated, like in the beginning of 2022 i My father and I got into a it was a very stupid tiff, but it was the true narcissistic form. He disowned me because I said I didn't want to do something with him, and that was the first time I said, okay, and I hung up, and I didn't call him back, and I didn't cry, I didn't speak to him for a year and a half after that, and I think at that moment it hit me, I finally lost the one thing I was terrified of all of my life was losing my father, right. You're gonna you want to be daddy's little girl, and you want your father to approve of you. And I finally had stood up and said, okay, I'm on my own. And I remember having a panic attack in the car because I owed him. He had invested in my company. And I was like, how am I going to do like, how am I going to do this? This is my money to live on. And I remember saying, it's worth it. You'll figure this out. And I didn't eat for like, days at a time. Like, there were some times where my mom would just send me, like, literally, a gift card to go get groceries, because she was like, I know you're not taking care of yourself, but my independence mattered so much more. And I was bootstrapping. I literally would just go on walks every day and go to the gym. That was all I could do, because I couldn't, I couldn't do anything more, but in that I found myself I was really able to stop and say, wait a minute. Okay, I'm so scared of losing somebody, but the one person I'm scared of losing, I finally lost. So now what do I have to lose? And so I started to say, You know what I'm gonna implement different things in dating. And it was slowly, it was a very slow progression over the year of okay, so this person doesn't text me every day. Let me see how that feels, but they show up. And so I started to challenge things. I started to have way deeper conversations, way more

Robin | With yourself

Sabrina | Myself and them, and I started to realize how I was meeting so many better kinds of people, because I wasn't scared of losing them, and I wasn't scared of showing up as myself, because I was I lost what I was scared of. I finally put that to rest. So now who are any of these people that I'm meeting on the internet? And so by the time I met my partner, the guy, realistically, when I met my partner online, there was something very special about him, but I was very oh, he's not my type. Let me go. Fine. And I remember even my mom saying, I like his smile. I think you should give it a try.

Robin | I love the fact that you talk about your mom a lot on your in your course, too, like you're close to her, but that's really cute. Okay, so you. Are okay. So you're thinking, he's really cute, he's different, he's but so okay.

Sabrina | Not my type at al.

Robin | Sorry to interupt you

Sabrina | No, please.

Robin | He's not your type. But I do my life, but I but I really do want to hear like, how he wasn't your type, and how he is actually really good for you. This is what like. This is what we need to learn, right?

Sabrina | Exactly. And that's why I talk about myself all the time. Is because I'm like, I can give you the clinical shit, but until you understand how to implement it, you're like, okay, it's ethereal. So for me, my type was the take the same it was cookie cutter. They were six four tattooed. They were trouble. You know, a six pack. You could run your tongue on..

Robin | They have to have tattoos. They have to be six four,

Sabrina | All of it, I was so, like, just so in my shit, of like, I'm not settling for less. And then I dated those guys, and every time I'd feel empty and I'd feel lost after and I dated a guy, and when Clem passed away, he wasn't there for me. And that was the moment of, I just did the hardest thing in my life. I had to make a decision to put my dog down, because he was, I mean, he was going to stay alive until he died, and I had to make that choice. And when I realized there was no one there with me besides me, it really struck me where I was, like, what am I fighting for with this relationship? I spent two months, and this guy didn't even come over after I put my dog down.

Robin | My dog just died. It's like, he's not there for me. It's like, actually, that's not the right person. No,

Sabrina | Wasn't there at all. And I had no problem. We dated for like, another week or two. You know, it was like something where I was mulling it over. It was, there was so much loss, I couldn't make that decision at the moment. And I just one night I said, I was like, I'm not doing this. And I left, and I remember, I didn't even like, I cried for like a second, and I got in the car, and then I came to San Diego with my mom instead, I was supposed to come with him for Thanksgiving, and that's when I said, I'm gonna just see what the apps have there for me. I'll change my app location. I'm not actively pursuing anything. I was thinking of moving here. We'll see my sister lives here, so I started to look at apartments while I was here, and then when I went out with Ryan, he was very sweet, but he was more closed off. He wasn't super expressive, he wasn't very gregarious, he didn't have a big personality. And I loved that, right? I love ooh, the banter and the sexy, but he would have these slivers where I would share something with him, and he was very empathetic, and he would listen to me, and he was compassionate, and he was funny, but then he would close back up. And so as we were kind of going along in the dating sphere, I started to realize you might not be necessarily what I thought I wanted, but you're exactly what I need, because he balanced me.

Robin | I just Love that.

Sabrina | And we always kind of say, like, I'm the picture, and he's the frame, I'm the picture, I'm the color, I'm the bright, I'm this,

Robin | You're the picture and he's the frame.

Sabrina | And he kind of,

Robin | I've never heard that before, that is so cute

Sabrina | Right. And so, like, he kind of keeps me structured, and he keeps me balanced, and he's very methodical and practical and and I'm more like, whatever. Let's just go with it. Who cares. And so we balance each other really well. And it was because I had gotten so much of what I didn't want that when I actually met somebody where I was like, whoa. First of all, the sex was great. So why was I gonna say no? But on top of that, wow, he was really trying. He just didn't do what the magazines and the Instagram people tell you, like, text me every single day and spend all this money on me. On the contrary, he texts me every other day or every two days, and he did a lot of home dates, because we genuinely got to know each other for who we were as people, not for this facade that we were building. And we went slow. I was in no rush, and saying, I listen, I don't need to be in a relationship just to be in a relationship, I want to be with the right person. And so we took like, four months before we said, okay, let's do this like I want to be in a relationship. We took us, you know, almost a year to move in together. We're two years in now, and we're just now talking about rings. There is no rush, because if this person's my person. Then all of these things have been falling into line so beautifully. And when I surrendered and just fucking let go, I was able to finally receive,

Robin | Wow, I really, I so hear that, and I really appreciate that. I think the rush thing is so like, just, we need to hear that. No rush.

Sabrina | It's,

Robin | If your person is your person . You actually need to take a lot of time. No, you need to, you need to actually take a lot of time and and actually get to know somebody. I think we're, we're way too much in a rush, like one big, two date, three dates. I mean, you really don't know that person. They're still a stranger. Even three dates, four dates, five dates, I mean, and that's okay. So how, when. So when you're working with clients, I mean, your course is fantastic, Sabrina, I hope people that are listening are going to take your Foundation Course. It's so good, it really is. It's eight weeks, right? And there's a lot, there's, there's, there's a lot that you can we can glean from it. When you're working with one on one clients, like, where do you start?

Sabrina | Usually where I start is, I'm always like, we're let's start where you're at now, because it gives us a jumping off point. And it typically starts with, I let them talk of like, and then I okay, fine, go, go, go, tell me all the issues, tell me everything. And then I just start to like, I really start to prode and prob, and I'll start like, if they say something, I'll, always tell them, like, hey, please don't mind if I interrupt. But there's sometimes we can't let this thought go on. And so, like, I had a client the other day, and it was getting over a breakup, and it was the first thing he says was, you know, after we were talking for a second, and he says, Well, she was perfect. And I instantly stopped and went, okay, I'd love to know what does that mean to you? Okay, name me three things that made her perfect. And he couldn't. He was like, she was, you know, she was active. And I was like, cool, that doesn't. There's millions of people on the planet that are active. What made her perfect, what made her so special? And I really challenge. And then I see if an emotion comes up, I'll usually stop and say, okay, close your eyes. Let's tap into the emotion. Where are you feeling this? What's coming up for you? Because usually the reason we do that is you're holding on to this person or this this, but usually it's a core belief that's really underneath that needs to come out, and we need to explore what version, what little, what part of you is trying to protect you from something or hold on to something out of fear or scarcity. And it's one of my favorite things to do. I love inner child work. It saved my life, and it's been a integral part. Has that something you've ever done.

Robin | Inner child work. Well, yes, with my therapist a lot like, I don't know if I would call it inner child, but we've definitely explored, like Robin as little girl. Is that in a child work? I guess so.

Sabrina | Yeah exactly. And it's because, you know, there's a little girl, little boy, little they, right? Whoever, however you identify, there's a little version of you in there that is just trying to protect you based on the information they learned at that time.

Robin | Definitely. So, so, okay, let's just go back to what this this client of yours said, What was that, that he thought, thought was perfect about that woman that he's looking for in the next person that you're not challenging. Because I think that's that's what we all have this. A lot of people have this list right of things that they're like, okay, this is my ideal person.

Sabrina | It ended up being that she was hot, okay, cool. It was like, she's an attractive woman. And what we really got down to was she didn't make him feel safe.

Robin | She did not make him feel safe

Sabrina | And we typically feel safe, and typically, we obsess over people that don't make us feel safe, because it's such a core wound. And as we discovered, and at first, he said, I have perfect child. My parents are amazing. And once I, you know, kind of explained to him when we're talking about your parents, it doesn't mean we need to villainize them. You know, I love my mother. I would set myself on fire for that woman. But I could also say in the same breath that woman failed me as a child and was not there in the ways that I needed her to. But she has but she has made amends. She has gone to therapy, and that woman worked so hard to be the mother I need her to be now. And we started to explore, and it turns out he had a lot of trauma that he normalized, and it's totally okay, but once we started to work through that, then we had our session three weeks later, and next thing I know, he was like, I had a week where I didn't think about her. And he was like, that was like, that was the biggest win I've had, because when we finally get down to the root as to what you're holding on to, it's no longer holding on to you.

Robin | My goodness, I love Oh my gosh, like that, right there. There's so many quotes. We're gonna make some quotes out of this conversation. Sabrina, I'm serious. Okay,

Sabrina | I'll slow down.

Robin | I love it. I love it. Okay, so I love that. I love the fact that you, in your course, you talk about just dating, right, online dating, or just dating in general, and how rejection is important. Let's talk about that, because online dating is a whole thing. I like what I want to what I want our listeners to walk away from in this, from our conversation, I hope is some tools and some skills to go forward in their dating life, okay and and understanding rejection is very important. I think.

Sabrina | 100%

Robin | Okay. So how do you frame that?

Sabrina | Rejection is redirection, rejection is, it's, it's just, how many times in a day do we get rejected for things that we want? Hi, can I please have that? Sorry, we're sold out. Oh, okay, I don't get what I want, right? But what ends up happening is rejection by definition. What the actual word mean to be rejected by somebody means to be ridiculed or judged for who you are that's being rejected. So then we have to stop and go. Let me zoom out. I went on one day with this person, and they didn't want to see me again. How could that have been? How could I have been rejected for who I am fundamentally, when this person doesn't know me fundamentally? And so I think we have to reframe rejection as part of dating. It's the same thing as anything else. And when I was an actor, this is the irony

Robin | Oh my gosh, when as an actor. I mean, I can only imagine

Sabrina | Every day was rejection, and the irony of it is, every day I got rejected and see a Creative Artist Agency was the number one agency I wanted on the fucking planet. I was, I mean, it's the biggest agency in the world. And fast forward 14 years, this morning, I got an email from them asking to have a conversation about being my agent. And I already have an agent, so I didn't need to pursue but it's one of those moments where you're like, you will get rejected. That does not mean that that's never going to happen for you. That just meant that how I wanted it to happen was not in the cards for me,

Robin | Exactly

Sabrina | But what was for me wasn't going to pass me. And so

Robin | Right what do you know when you will not pass you. And that is. Yeah, that is a it is not just a belief. It's a truth. But people don't know that, but understand it. No, I

Sabrina | I did a video that went viral the other day about, what if I told you that in six to eight months you were going to meet your partner and you didn't have to worry about a thing? How would you start to show up if you were dating? How would you start to show up with these people? And a lot of people were like, oh, yeah, because you know, be I wouldn't have as much anxiety I would feel protected, and it's like and that's the belief that we need to come into dating with that, and that's the belief I had. I kept saying, I don't know how it's going to happen, and I don't know when, but I do know it will and I'll be ready for it when it does. And I think when it comes to dating and things like that, we have to also remember, if you're terrified of being rejected, other people can sense that, and I think we need to be realistic. Like, I thought no one could tell that I was anxious. And even when I met Ryan, he was like, babe, within two minutes of you opening your mouth, I could tell you an anxiety, and it's not a bad thing. But he was like, stop trying to hide it. You know,

Robin | Oh my God I just think that's awesome. That's so funny. Like, I think about when I was dating my I first started dating my partner, Hector, and the same thing, because I was like, super anxious. It was so much going on in my life at the time that we met. It was just like, I felt like I was in a well, is it? What is this? A tornado? I really was, I was in it, and I was doing my best to manage everything at the same time, but I was in a fucking tornado. And I was like, and he knew it, because you could sense it. He was like, yes, you're anxious, and he's like, but now you're different because he's like, in the beginning, when we first met you, just, I guess it was buzzing. I must have been I thought I was presenting myself in a normal way

Sabrina | Energy, right. It's also, how do you carry yourself. How do you you know and like my you know, Ryan always says he's like, I always knew you're secure in our partnership. He was like, but you have anxiety as a human, it's not hard to see. And so it's more of like, you know, when we're we're looking at somebody who's scared of rejection well, then what usually ends up happening is they're not showing up as themselves. They're not being authentic. They're so scared that someone's not going to like them, that they try to be other people, or try to be another version of themselves because they're scared, and that's okay. But then how do you want to connect with somebody when they don't really know who you are? So when it comes to online dating, oh, first off the that, even just in general, I am so tired of hearing that the apps are the problem. Now here's the reality.

Robin | No no no

Sabrina | Stop blaming. Stop blaming the casino for the having a gambling problem. You have a problem because you don't have self discipline. It is not their fault. Now, listen, does the brain do its thing? Absolutely, but you can also work on that. So when it comes to the apps, of course, listen, they're in it to make money. It's a business, right. I have met every serious relationship I've had. We've been on apps, three of them and three different ones in my adult life, including the person I'm with.

Robin | Yes

Sabrina | Because, sure, prior back in the day, oh, I wish I could meet people like they did in the olden days. Do you though, because proximity and timing, you could only date who was around you, because how were you gonna meet other people if you didn't have technology? So what it's about, it's not about I'm tired. You know, Ryan always says this. People always ask and say, I don't want to be on the dates. They make me the apps make me uncomfortable. I hate them. And he always says, do it, and why? And he says, because do things that make you uncomfortable. Stop trying to make everything so comfortable. Obviously, if you don't feel safe, if you don't, that's a different story. But if you're just, well, I, you know, I just get too anxious and, like, I just did a okay, well, meeting somebody out in person isn't going to change how you feel about the courtship. So when it comes to online dating, become a better buyer. Be intentional. First of all, me and Ryan do dating we do dating app audits. That's like, part of the thing that we do

Robin | Dating app audits. That's awesome.

Sabrina | I cannot tell you how many come in and we're like, Well, like I one of my clients. I love her, and she's so intentional. She's done so much work. This woman is amazing. But yeah, she kept dating these guys where I was like, she would send me the screenshots. And I was like, oh, where are you finding these people? She sent me her dating profile. And I was like, thank you. Completely sexualized, no information about her, nothing of depth, nothing to even tell me who she is, photos of boobs out and her and everything was a bikini or a swimsuit,

Robin | Of course that's who you're attracting, you're like, you're putting it out there.

Sabrina | And we wonder why you're not getting the right match. Because you're not giving anything for people to actually connect with you on.

Robin | Okay, well, let's, let's go there. I really want to hear how you are when you're doing these audits. You and Ryan, what is the guidance what on how to actually present yourself like in words and in pictures, like, what are you doing?

Sabrina | Oh, we go and we break down every single part. So every prompt, every photo, first things, first 60% of people make a decision within two seconds on a dating app. Okay, let that one sink in. You have seconds to get someone's attention. This is your resume, baby. This is your this is your calling card. It's the same as when you walk down a street, someone looks at you. You've got a mere second to get their attention. So what we have to do is be strategic. Is your first photo. There is a study done recently that showed when you take a photo from an angle above 10% above your crown that shows in security, and so when you have tons of selfies where. It's really, you know, think about the side angle.

Robin | What's 10% I'm like, oh,

Sabrina | Exactly, just above. So, like, it could be here, but like, you want it to be right in front of your face, right. You want the crown and your chin to be in line. So, and that's okay if you're saying, Oh, I think I have a lot of selfies. Like, do not have a selfie as your first photo. Do not have, do not have your group photo as your first photo. I don't want to have to figure out which one you are. Make sure that you are not using tons of filters. Make sure that your photos are updated. Please stop using photos from 15 years ago. Make sure that you are the weight and the height and the who are you actually, it's not fair to say, well, okay, so what I gained 30 pounds from my photos, but they didn't accept me. It's like they don't have to. Okay, you, I'm sorry. It's like, it's not, it's you have mear seconds. And this is a reality. And it's not me being an asshole. This is me understanding how human psychology works.

Robin | It's true

Sabrina | You have seconds, and whoever says looks don't matter, maybe not to you, but to other people, they do. So we see that, and then what we'll see all the time is people love to put on prompts. Like, the prompts either bullshit, of like, you know, the way to the way to my heart is, or, like, the fastest way to take me out is to ask, and it's like, would you stop with this nonsense? Of just like, Did you Google it and just find what other people put or it's everything, of like, I want someone that's self aware and thoughtful and this, and it's just everything about, I want someone that does all these things. And it's like, Do you really think someone's sitting there going, oh, my God, I'm all these things. Let me message them, but you didn't tell me anything about you. Who are you,

Robin | Right

Sabrina | Like, so how are you growth minded?

Robin | How are you helping people create, like, a really good profile? Because really, this is important, right? It's your resume.

Sabrina | We first thing we have to talk about is like the photos, obviously, is making sure. A suggestion I always have is go out to lunch with a friend and ask them to snap a few shots of you with you're not even paying attention. Those are usually the best ones. If you're smiling, looking

Robin | I like I like that, yeah that's a good idea

Sabrina | That or that's a good whatever, right? Tell your friends, tell people in your life that you need photos for a dating app. There is no one that's going to want to help you more, especially as a guy, than your girlfriends, your girl, your female friends in your life are going to go, oh my God, give me your phone. Let's go. So like, ask, ask friends in your life. Hey, can I show you my profile? Do you think this represents me? And if they say, No, I don't like I've had that I send to my friends, and they're like, dude, this is so you great. Or I've seen friends do that to me, and I'm like, I'm sorry. You're five, eight. You put six one, you know, like, it's come on. So doing that. Then when it comes to the prompts, have conversation fodder. Have a prompt that will elicit a conversation. Because if you're going on the profile, and the only thing someone's gonna do is heart your photos, because you don't have depth to you, then there's nothing for them to talk to you about. And if you're about

Robin | Can you give us an example please Sabrina, like, Give us an example, like somebody.

Sabrina | So my prompt, I'll give you mine. When I was dating, I had, I had three very specific prompts, one of them, which the first one was, you should go out with me if it said, your growth minded, I'm, you know, it was like something like that, like, you're growth minded, you're investing in yourself. I'm not looking for anything casual, really here seeking real connections and somebody that I could actually co create with. So there was a nice like, okay,

Robin | Oh I like that somebody I can co create with.

Sabrina | Oh, super important. And then under it, then I went to the jokey one, it said, like, one thing you should know about me is I eat dinner to get to dessert, and I always have a snack in my bag, right. Priorities, what's yours? Right? So it's like,

Robin | I like,it that your funny too

Sabrina | The reality

Robin | Shows that you're actually funny too. Like, that is,

Sabrina | Here's a reality too. Like, I also have snacks in my bag and I have a cupcake tattoo. It's not a lie, right. Like, I wasn't,

Robin | This is true.

Sabrina | It's true. And then I had one more that said, like, a sign of a great first date is it actually happens. I'm new from New York to LA. This one I moved to LA. So I said, go easy on me, but let's get off this app and into real life. And so it was like, three separate ways. Okay, you want to talk about the depth. I can't tell you how many people were like, This is a breath of fresh air. You want to do something like the dessert one. I can't tell you how many guys were like, all right, where's your favorite place? What's your place? What's your go to? Are we an ice cream or that? It starts the conversation

Robin | Oh that's so good.

Sabrina | Or the, you know, I sign up for a great first date. It actually happens. I would have guys, great. What are you free Saturday? Let's make this happen. And I'd say, great. Let's have a phone call, vibe check, and then if I liked them, let's do it. It's about showing up. How you want, how do you want to be represented?

Robin | I really like that. Okay, so let's talk about even that. Like, so you are doing a phone call and a vibe check, like, because you do before you get ready for the first date. Like, are you advocating for that?

Sabrina | I'm a fan. Okay, so I'm a fan of that if you haven't had a lot of correspondence. Like, if a guy, if somebody, I'm obviously a heterosexual woman, so I'm going to speak in those norms. But for me personally, if a man was messaging me and saying, let's meet immediately, I'd say, well, let's FaceTime, right. Let me just get to because I haven't had any correspondence. Versus some guys I had where the banter is so funny that you're like, I don't really give a shit. At this point, I'm having so much fun talking to this person and we're back and forth, maybe we're voice noting that at that point, I'm like, great, let's set a plan for me if within three days of talking to somebody in on app, we don't if three days was a lot, and I'm talking three days of not every, you know, not all day, every day, back and forth, within three days of matching, if we're not going out on that date, or at least planning to go out on the date, I'm not wasting any more of my time. I don't need a pen pal. I don't need a hookup. I don't need something casual. I'm intentional, and I want you to show up like that. So it was really important to make sure that, like all of those, all of those dots aligned. And so for people that write in saying, Well, I get all these pen pals. Stop allowing it, stop engaging with them.

Robin | There's boundaries. Like you, like you, do a great job, in your course, talking about this Sabrina around, like, you have to have boundaries. You have to create. Like, how is it you want, okay, so you're, you're coaching people to do, is it is like, you know, we've got rules, but is there, is it a rule? Is it like, okay, three days, texting, four days, maybe five, maybe a week. Like, what if you live quite far away, like, what is, what is your guidelines around that?

Sabrina | I think it really depends on, it's very nuanced, because it also depends on the circumstances. Do you have kids? Are you takelLike, I've had clients that are taking care of elderly parents. Okay that's a different dynamic. Or I'm, I'm partial custody, I'm full custody. I've got 50% I've got 20% I've got 100% I work two jobs. You know, when it comes to for me, it's more of like, does it make sense proximity and timing? Is this person traveling? Obviously, if they travel, you're not going to be able to meet in three days, but it's are you, at the very least, both intentional about what you're doing? Because if you're talking to somebody, you're talking all day, right? You're texting non stop, and you're okay, so you both have time to do that, but yet you can't meet to just go have a conversation in person, right? And typically, then we see that it'll happen for two, three months, and then all of a sudden it's, you know, this person's starting to pull away. It's like, because it's

Robin | Two to three months oh not real, oh my god, no. It'snot a real oh no.

Sabrina | I've had, I've had clients that have said they've talked to people online on apps for 3,4,5,6, months, and have never met this person. And that's my concern with the long distance stuff when you meet on a dating app, is because you create a false sense of intimacy with this person. When you're texting, it has no tone. I get to create how I would say this to me if that were me. I get to create an entire it's like reading, right? You read a book, and you create the narrative, you create the character, and then they make the movie of it, and you're like, that's what I imagined. I didn't think that she was blonde. I thought she was a brunette, because there's no tone, right? I get to create that. And so, yeah, there are definitely, I mean, there are some folks that will do that, and long distance for me, I've seen it fail more than I've seen it successful. I do believe in it. It's, don't get me wrong. I think there are circumstances. It takes two incredibly willing participants who have the means, the opportunity, the finances and the time to go back and forth, because at the end of the day, what is your end game? I hear this all the time of like, I live in Chicago, and this person I like lives in California. Okay, well, we don't we're both work three jobs. We have two kids, you know, sorry, not all of us have the free time. So then why are you dating this person?

Robin | There's no intention on either one of you to move like this. Your lives are in these cities. So you like, what's the point?

Sabrina | What are we doing? Right? We are we doing? You don't have money. You're working three jobs. Okay? So then What? What? You can't go back and forth and see each other. So then what relationship are you building? And I get it, it can get lonely. But that doesn't mean that we need to replace loneliness with some person on the phone that we don't even know half these people if they are rea.

Robin | Absolutely, absolutely not. Okay. So one of, one of my favorite parts of your course, was around trusting your intuition. I think this is really key, because it's like, you know, you meet people and you're like, you know, I also like what you just said, Sabrina, around, like the vibe, okay. I think it's very important that before you get ready for your first date, you do have phone call, or you do have some sort of, I don't know, okay, yeah, okay, I didn't do that before I met my partner and but it's like, you want to, you want to feel good, right before you feel good about this person, before you're going to meet them for the first time, right? And a lot of that has to do with our intuition

Sabrina | Yes I think also where it becomes interesting. Here is, it also depends on how you're dating. Like for me, I didn't have to vibe check every guy because I did very practical dates I'm not gonna get, excuse me, I met you on the internet. I live in LA. You think I'm gonna get dressed up, put my hair and makeup, do the whole kit and caboodle to go out with you and find out you're a total dud. No, what I did was, hey, I'm gonna go walk my dog. You wanna meet me by the beach and we'll go for a stroll. If this is good, we can meet for a dinner or hey, do you want to meet me? I'm gonna go get a coffee. I have to go. I had to grab I had to go to Erewhon. I wanted to go to Erewhon, and I'm gonna be on Abbot Kinney. Do you want to meet me? We can go grab a matcha, take a stroll. Guys loved it because they're like, perfect, great. Let's just see if we like each other. Do we have a conversation? Am I attracted to at all, physically and emotionally and mentally?

Robin | Okay,

Sabrina | That way. Then now listen, there were guys that I definitely like, especially when we'd send each other photos. You see the Insta, you're like, Okay, we know they're real. Of course, the when they're really attractive, and I be like, fuck it. I'll go to dinner with this person. But that was a decision I made, because I was able to balance and pendulum between, let me see. I want to get ready, and especially when you're like, listen, I haven't gone on a date in like, three months. Oh, I want to experience it. But sometimes when we do, we get all ready, and we do all this, it can be even more disappointing, because you feel like you're putting so many eggs in this basket, versus make it a practical date. Hey, I have to go grab groceries. You want to meet for 45 minutes? There's a Starbucks, there's a coffee shop, whatever. Let's chat, let's hang most people are going to be cool with that when they're trying to not waste their time.

Robin | I like that. I like that. I like the first date being just like, let's just just being actually, really light. Okay, let's go for the walk. Let's do like, right? That's good.

Sabrina | Think about meeting someone in person. If you met that in person, in person, you don't just go to you're not at dinner, and for the first time, you meet this person. You meet them out, you talk, you have a vibe check you got, you give your number. They ask you to dinner because you met them. So we have to look at it in the same way of like, hey, you know, for me, when I lived in New York and LA, I was going on some weeks 10 dates, some weeks none. But you are, when you're an active dater, it gets exhausting to get all dolled up, to come home and.

Robin | No, right, right. Okay, well, let's talk about the intuition piece, though, and how important that is, and how people and how I I've been guilty of it. A little note, I was talking to Kirsten about this and my best friend like that. I said that I work with, and we were taking your course, and we're like, let's talk about the intuition stuff and how, like, when I was dating, before I met my partner, I would dating this one guy, and there were, there were like, little things that were coming up that I was like, watch for that. Like, you know, you get the you get kind of like, it's not a red flag. Like, sometimes it's a red flag. You're like, no, okay. Like, we all know what red flags are, but there's like, maybe, like, little yellow, like, like warning, maybe this, it doesn't feel good, that doesn't that doesn't sit right with me, or that's not aligned with me. And it's like, kind of collecting those, how do you are you guiding your clients around that just right?

Sabrina | Body sensations are really important, because notice how what you said was, when your intuition happened, it's very calming. That doesn't feel right, right? It's just like a, it's a, it's a blush pink, little flag, right? It's not a full red, but there's something in you going, I don't like that, right? I'm a woman. When I lived in New York, and I would walk by a dark alley, I didn't think twice before going, that doesn't feel safe. I need to walk across the street, right? Like,

Robin | Right

Sabrina | That's your intuition,

Robin | Exactly

Sabrina | Versus your anxiety or the insecurities or whatever they come with, body sensations. Typically we feel at my chest, I can't breathe. I feel like I'm gonna die because you're dysregulated. And when you're dysregulated, your nervous system actually feels like you're gonna die, so it's trying to keep you safe. Then it also comes with a narrative. It usually revolves around, why wasn't I good enough? What's wrong with me? Why can't I get them? But do they not like me? It's about, typically, your shortcomings, if you will, if you even want to use that word, but it's typically revolves around a narrative and a core belief more than if somebody was, let's say we're on a date and I see one of those pink flags and I'm going they say something, they go, Oh, I don't like that. Didn't love that, right? That's very different than I might wholly overlook that, and at the end of the day, just be wondering, but I understand, but why? But do they not like me? Did they not think I was pretty I don't understand, but, but why? Even they called me? They haven't even texted me. I thought we had a great date, but you never actually stopped on the date to ask yourself, did I did I choose this person too? And so typically, when we see, intuition is a very calm little thing. But oftentimes, if we don't hone that voice, then we just go, Oh, whatever. I don't I don't trust myself. I don't know any better than that. No, they're amazing, and they're so good looking, and I just really want them to choose me. That's usually anxiety. And that's when that anxious narrative starts to play, and then the body sensations play in versus your intuition is typically a very calming grounding, this just doesn't feel right reaction,

Robin | Right

Sabrina | So understanding the difference in dating is really important.

Robin | Yes it is. It's very important. It's very important to like, it's funny because that I only had three dates with this man that I'm talking about, and he was the one we had our third date at a restaurant, and he said to me, at the end of the night, you know what, Robin, I've just been, you know, thinking about this and over time. And he's like, I'm just not attracted to you. I've been trying to get there, but I'm just not attracted to you. And and I'm like, I just looked at him. I said, alrighty then, like, what can there's nothing I can do about that. And I got up and left the restaurant. I grabbed my coat and I walked out the door. I mean, there's nothing to say. I mean, we're done here, and thank you for telling me. And I called my cousin immediately, and I said, like, can you believe this just happened? But I'm like, thank I was grateful that he was honest. And it was like, it was definitely a rejection, but in a redirection, right? Like you talk about

Sabrina | Because you him doing that would not have led you to Hector, right? Like, then you wouldn't have

Robin | No, it was perfect. It was

Sabrina | I had a similar So the guy that I was talking about that I dated before Ryan same thing happened. He said, You know, I just don't think I'm attracted to you anymore. You're beautiful. Don't get me raw. He come and I looked at me, then we're done here, and that's why I walked out. I was like, that's why I didn't cry. I said, we're good.

Robin | I did not cry. I did not no, of course not. It was like, Well, I mean, I don't even know this guy

Sabrina | More just, exactly. I was like, more of just a frustration where you're like, god damn it,

Robin | Oh yeah.

Sabrina | But same thing just, you know what I don't need to convince you. I don't need to that's that intuition where you're intuition where you're just like, Fuck this. I'm done. Versus the anxiety would have been like, well, what's wrong with me? But why don't you like me? What can I do to get them and you start to get you feel it in your body. Your intuition is a get out of here girl, let's go. You deserve better.

Robin | Oh, that's exactly how I felt. I felt like, really powerful at that moment when I walked out the door with with my coat and said, pay the bill like I didn't. I didn't. I didn't offer money. I mean, I paid the bill the other the other date, the other day, being before that, so I didn't feel bad about that. But I'm like, that's it, man. Like it was good. Actually, it was really good.

Sabrina | And can we normalize as well while we're here, can we normalize as well, having grace receiving those messages, because it takes a lot of courage for someone to end it and not ghost and say to your face, hey, I'm sorry.

Robin | I actually appreciated the fact that he was very honest with me. I really I wasn't mad at him, and I wasn't unkind, and I was just like, okay, like, I was just, I said, thank you for telling me, and I walked out the door.

Sabrina | There you go.

Robin | Actually, that took courage of him to say too.

Sabrina | Exactly. That's what I mean, both of you guys, it took a lot of courage. Of courage, because I did that video on ghosting recently, and people just lost their shit on it. And it's like, here's the reality. We need to have grace, that if someone's going into people are like, that sounds like, HR, I do. I'd rather someone ghost me than tell me that they don't want to pursue a connection. It's like you're upset that someone's direct and honest with you, and that makes you because you feel so low about yourself, you'd rather make this about you than have someone just honestly tell you about it. And can we normalize, not freaking out like Ryan tells me all the time, but he he dated a lot, you know, active dater in San Francisco for 10 years, and he said that he was like, I can't tell you how many girls I would text them and say, like, after one or two dates, like, hey, I'm not interested in pursuing this. And I would get berated by texts, yelled at and screamed at, harassed women, saying you wasted my time. He's like, we had one date. What are you talking about? Like, what do you mean wasted? You lied to me. You said you wanted a relationship. He's like, I didn't say I wanted one with you.

Robin | Right

Sabrina | And so it's we need to have grace that it might hurt, and you're more than okay and allowed to say, hey, that sucks. But if you're not in a relationship with somebody and you're not exclusive, you're just first five dates, and someone says, hey, I'm not feeling it, just let them go. Stop trying to convince them, stop trying to change their mind. Accept it and say, thank you so much. I'd rather know now than find this out in six more months.

Robin | Absolutely. I really like that. So Sabrina, what do you do, what, how are you coaching people around, you talk about this in your course. But like, how do you coach people around dating fatigue? Like, I've got a best friend who, I mean, she is, she's working, she's working it. I mean, really though she's putting so much time and effort and and she's dating, like, consistently. You just said that about Ryan, right? 10 years. I mean, that's a long time, right? I'm gonna say, like, maybe it's been six years since she's six or seven years that she's actually been looking for her next partner, like, she really wants to be in a relationship. And I'm sure you've got a lot of clients like this, so how, how are you helping people with that? Like, like, it's a new approach, or is it like an attitude? Like,

Sabrina | Yeah I think so. Ryan, we it was both of us. I was 15 years of dating on and, I mean, we both had, like, you know, you have the like, nine monthers or the five monthers or, yeah, you know, you throw the little randoms in. But for me, it was five years. I did not have like, an actual relationship beyond the two or three monther or, you know, that when they fizzle out quickly. So I was there. I totally understand the fatigue. I had many a crying nights. I had many nights where I was just like, I'm fucking done. One more person, one more text, right? And that's where. So for me, I will start to say, okay, then we need to have some boundaries here, because we have to start to look at one what's the mindset? How much importance are we putting on this? Because mama always says they're in addition to your life, not instead of you need to have good with good without. You need to be good with yourself and be good without other people as well, because you're not going to be okay if you I hear this all the time, well, I'm not good without them. It's like, well, then you're not going to be good with them, because it's not your life isn't contingent on if they're in it, because it's a very dangerous place to be because you're living for someone else. So off the bat, I kind of want to understand a little bit more there. Then if we go, it's like, Great, let's set some parameters here. Maybe that means that you don't go on dates every single night. And maybe that means that we say, hey, let's make it a coffee so it's not as intensive. It's not as much. You're not putting as much energy. You're not investing stop with the digital so much before we don't need to text. You don't need to have 12 facetimes with someone before meeting. You don't need to talk to them for three weeks before meet. Just go if you're going to be on a dating app, talk for a little make sure you have something in common if you want to FaceTime, make sure this person's real. Go tell your friends where you're going to be. Do not go walking to what you have to have safety, right? You could give a Google phone number. You do. Do not have to give your private information. Do not use photos on a dating app that can be Googled and fact and searched back to who you are, right? You don't want to use a professional photo that you use on Linkedin

Robin | I have't actually thought about that before, but that's actually smart. I've never heard that before.

Sabrina | If you're using your LinkedIn photo and then they reverse Google image search. They just found out all your information. They know where you work, they know your company, they know who you are.

Robin | Oh, geez.

Sabrina | So parameters, right? This is the Internet. The Internet has a very dark side to it. And so there's that. So when we're talking about fatigue, it's also about taking the breaks where they're necessary, right? Doing things that fill your own cup, making sure that you support yourself, and making sure that you're journaling, making sure that you are seeking help, mental help, with the right facilities and places that you can actually feel safe. And then there's also the end of reality. Like, I have one of my clients, and she's in her 50s, and she's never been married, and she was getting that dating app fatigue, or just dating fatigue in general, and we really worked on her being okay alone, and now she's still dating, but she's like, man, I feel free. I don't need to.

Robin | I love that you are, like, working on that with her.

Sabrina | Like yeah to like, help feel because here's the thing, I don't have any guarantee that you will meet somebody, but I don't have a guarantee that you won't. So what we can do is say, live your life the best you can without this person, so that when they're when you're ready to receive them, and you meet this person, you already have a beautiful life to include them into.

Robin | Oh, my goodness, I love that. I really, really do. I think I was yes. I was talking, this was just last week. I was talking to a dating coach named Cat Cantrill, that we met, that I met last year, and she's fantastic. She said, when you're on your online profile, make it so that you can somebody that's looking at your profile, can see what it would be like to be included in your life. This is what it would be like, like, right? And I thought, actually, that is what do you think about that?

Sabrina | 100% that's why, I mean, it's your resume, right? This is what you're right. You're showing when you go to a job interview, you're like, This is what it would be like to have me as an employee, right? You're coming in.

Robin | Well, you're right, yes, yes,

Sabrina | Right.

Robin | Yeah

Sabrina | So it's like 100% I look at it as, you want to be the CEO of your life, right? Or, sorry, you're the founder of your life. You're the founder of your company, and you're hiring for the CEO the most important position. Are you going to give that to somebody because they walked by your house and said they thought it was pretty so you just throw them the keys? No, you're going to vet this person. I want to see you in different environments. How are we when we fight? How are we when we have repair conflict, things like that? Because absolutely you want someone to say, hey, you've got a really beautiful life that's really full. I want to be in addition to it, but it's very overwhelming. I have dated people like that where you're like, you're only okay if I'm in your life. And that's really scary.

Robin | Oh, so what? What can you just before we like, what does that mean? I don't I don't understand what you just said.

Sabrina | Meaning like they're so anxious and they're so why haven't you called me, but you haven't texted me, but what am I going to see you again? They're so involved with Are you going to choose them, they have not stopped to live their own life. Because for a lot of people, when it's like, well, I don't like my job and I don't like this. This is all I have. Well, it's a very, very tough spot to be in because it's putting a lot of pressure on someone else to satisfy all of those needs that one person never can. And so you want to build that beautiful life, and it's like, yeah, you want to showcase it. I wouldn't say that my dating profile necessarily showcased the life that you were going to have with me, but what it did show was, it showed my interest. It showed that I work out all the time. It showed that I eat dessert. It showed that I'm brilliant to fashion. It showed that I'm super quirky and, like, kind of a little weird. It showed those aspects. Same with Ryan. He had photos of him dancing, we don't go dancing, right? Like, that's not part of his life. But it showed his personality, that he's fun and he's goofy, and he went parachuting with his friend, and they had them in their funny little outfits. What I got from that was, you're quirky, you're fun, you're cute, you have a side to you that I think I can resonate with. You're not stoic. It's not a bunch of football photos, or you and your boys playing golf. I wouldn't be interested in that.

Robin | Yeah. Well, I'm going to tell you, I'm going to tell you a little bit about how I met Hector, because I think that this really showed how it all, it's like, played out, and how I really, like, fell in love with this guy from the beginning, because what he asked me is, in my profile, I can't even remember how I did I did say in my profile that the way I look at life is the glass is overflowing, like, and that's actually how I look at life. I'm always looking at the positives, right? And I need somebody, I need somebody that looks at life that way, as in, look at the positives. Because if you're a downer, it's not going to work, right. So one of the first so his prompt was around, he wakes up in the morning and he goes to the pool, and he does the sauna and the pool. And I was like, that's very unique. Like, because one of the prompts was, what, how do you wake up in the morning? Like, what, what is, how do you start your day? And he answered that, and I thought that was, like, quite different, right? So I said, like, wow. Like, that's awesome. Like, where do you go? Where do you swim? It was a question, which I think is good to ask a question to the prompt.

Sabrina | Yeah.

Robin | And he told me the pool that he swims at, and then he engaged in the conversation back to me, and he said, what are you grateful for today? Sabrina, who asked that question, who, like, so beautiful, like, you're speaking my language, you are speaking my language. Like, honestly, grateful, great. Like, I pray all the time, and I'm always thankful, like, as I'm walking through the life my life, I'm always thanking, like, life, for life, you know, so like

Sabrina | 100%

Robin | Like you had me grateful, like, what.

Sabrina | And see that, here's the funny thing, had you not known yourself well enough, you would have probably overlooked that and gone, what if i What do you mean? What am I grateful for? Right? But you know yourself, and you're like, I need somebody that's that's into health and wellness, that's into those things. And you saw, oh, you go to the pool. Okay, so you're active. Oh, that's cool routine, right? Asking a question, probing the conversation. He asks you one back. That's what we might I serve the ball. You serve the ball. It's a nice, okay, it's back and forth. This is fun. We're enjoying it. We're having a good conversation. It's in line, because if somebody I'll see you honest. If someone asked me, like, what are you grateful for today in LA, they asked me that, and I'd be like

Robin | So is that? Is that a thing that people in LA do? Because in Victoria, people don't do that.

Sabrina | Yeah. LA is ahhh

Robin | Okay. Maybe in LA that would be like, a line. Yeah, it was not a line, but in Victoria no, trust me.

Sabrina | Exactly. But you see how for me, I'd be like the cynical New Yorker in me, be like what the fuck, did you just ask me? But that shows you he's not my person, right? Like, and I know that I'm not trying to make it something it's not, but you knew yourself well enough to go that's what I want and need, and it works for me, and I fucking love that,

Robin | Yes, oh my gosh, yes, yeah, that's good. That's good, yeah, oh my gosh, I love it. I really, I love talking to you. You're the best. Sabrina. Thank you so much for everything today, like, for your time and, like, no, really, and the work you're doing, like you're, I know you're helping so many people with I think, is one of the best things. This is what we do, right at Real Love Ready. We're helping people build better relationships. And I think when it comes to finding a partner, I mean, that is one of the biggest, most important decisions you're going to make, right?

Sabrina | You're hiring a CEO

Robin | Yep, but it, but it comes down to which is what you're teaching so much in your course and what you're living. It comes down to yourself and loving yourself first, and honoring yourself in so many ways, like in your course, you're talking about boundaries. You're talking about like looking at your patterns, making sure that right. It's so much introspection that we need to do so that we are choosing a really good partner and a healthy relationship and creating a healthy relationship. Right

Sabrina | You said, keyword that we are choosing, that we get agency. Because oftentimes we get dysregulated, we get exhausted, we get all those things. And when we're dysregulated, we feel we have no choice anymore. And then when we come back to that moment of saying, well, wait a minute, I'm in my body right now. I'm not six anymore. I'm not scared. I'm gonna lose mommy or daddy. I'm here now. I have a choice, and I get to choose me first, and then I'll decide. I'll never forget Sex and the City Samantha, I love you, Richard, but I love me more, right? And it's like it's just that famous line of just a fierce of a woman who says, I am not scared to take up space. I am not scared to say no, because I know for every no, a yes is coming, and I implement that in my business. I say no to ads all the time, brands all the time. I'm not scared that more are not going to come, because I know it's a revolving door, because what I'm aligning is coming to me when I say no to what is not in alignment with me.

Robin | Wow, yes. Awesome. Exactly. I love it. Me too.

Sabrina | Thank you. I'm so excited. Thank you, Robin.

Robin | 'm so excited. So we are going to close with a blessing. We do this with every podcast, and it's with your words, sweetheart. So thank you. May we learn how to disconnect from the impulses, triggers and patterns that no longer serve us.

Sabrina | Amen

Robin | May we be open to learn, reflect and transform our thoughts and actions one step at a time. It is really about like day to day and one step at a time and over time, those changes make a huge difference. They really do. May we release limiting beliefs about dating and stop negative self talk, it's time to replace those thoughts with an attitude of gratitude and focus on learnings involved with dating, because actually, dating is such a learning ground, isn't it like really it is.

Sabrina | There. You will hurt in relationships. You will heal in relationships.

Robin | Yeah and may we honor our inherent self worth while dating and in relationship by giving ourselves the utmost love, care and respect first, in order to offer these to another.Yeah. It's about our self worth, really. So thank you, Sabrina.

Sabrina | Of course, amen to that. I think at the end of the day, it's like it starts with us and it ends with us. So it's like, you want that relationship. It's out there. It's just a matter of you believing that you're worthy and deserving of it.

Robin | Yeah, yeah, that's for sure. Thank you so much,

Sabrina | Thanks, Robin.

Robin | I'm so grateful for you.